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Comparison test: Compass RM7A vs Whites GMT vs Minelab 3000

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Comparison test: Compass RM7A vs Whites GMT vs Minelab 3000

Canuck-luck
If this isn't the most eclectic group of detectors that have ever been compared in a test then I'll eat my nuggets. So I owned the Minelab for about 5 years but quite honestly only swung it a half dozen times or less until the economy forced me to sell it, heck it was just collecting dust anyways. The GMT belongs to a friend that allowed me to use it on occasion, and the RM7A is my current and only detector. I am really only a gold prospector so that's really the only types of specimens that I used in this air-test. Here's a picture of the gold pieces that I used.







The 1 ounce and 5 gram bullion pieces were used as a standard that could easily be reproduced and I am aware that they do not represent and example of what kind of shape of gold that one might find in the ground. The nuggets are 4 grams, 1/2 gram, and 1/5 gram roughly. So from what I've heard, air tests are a good way to test the maximum depth of a detector under ideal soil conditions, and in this test I would simply record how deep each detector could detect each example that I had here. The paint can was for a cache test, I've heard of stuff being burried in them, but whatever, it's also a standard that can be reproduced. I also did a test on an aluminum clad penny for only the Compass model only because I noticed that this is something that seems to be used for comparisons on these forums and it also gave a method to determine my errr ummm lack of skill level. With this test I had banged a wooden stick into the ground with inch measurements running up it with my various pieces of gold laid at the bottom on a trashless piece of ground. Heres my results and quite honestly I am a newbie so the numbers could be an inch off either way.


Metal detector depth tests


     Size           Minelab GP3000     Whites GMT      Compass RM7A                
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
1/75 gram              ----                 on coil                  ----  
1/25 gram              ----                  2 inch                  ----
1/13 gram              ----                  4 inch                  ----
1/5 gram               on coil               5 inch                 on coil
1/2 gram               2 inch                --?--                  2 inch
4 gram                  --?--                 --?--                  6 inch
5 gram (bullion)      15 inch              10 inch                9 inch
1 ounce (bullion)     21 inch              12 inch              12 inch
paint can (1 gal)     53 inch               --?--                32 inch
2004 penny            --?--                 --?--                  9 inch


I really don't have any vested interest in any of these detectors in that I have nothing to sell, I mearly thought that I would share my findings with you guys because they had no real purpose just sitting in a file folder'in my desk. The question marks were placed in spots where I never actually did use the detector on that gold example and the blank spaces just meant that the detector could not detect that small of gold. Anyhow the minelab is really a deep seeker but what I found interesting was that it was not very good for finer gold and it really couldn't compete with the GMT for the first 2 grams of gold or less or to put it another way the GMT had the ability to find a far smaller piece of gold than the minelab for the first 7 inches or so. I was very impressed with my 30 year old Compass in that it at least was not completely obliterated by the competition such as you would normally have if you were comparing something like a 25 year old computer vs a new one. Anyways the Minelab priced out at $3000 five years ago the GMT was $800 and the 30 year old compass was $20 to me or $300 new in the early 1980s. Thoughts? Good or bad . . .


Ron
Compass Relic Magnum 7 A
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Re: Comparison test: Compass RM7A vs Whites GMT vs Minelab 3000

FoilFinder
Interesting test Ron, thanks for that. You know if you ad iron magnetite or graphite soils in the equation, like we have west of the Rockies,
the GMT would not find the small stuff due to its high gain (high beams analogy)and the RM7 would show superiority in bad ground, due to it's lower frequency and lower gain.(fog lights)
Of course with the GPX it would not make much of a difference either way.

HH

FoilFinder
In the ol'frontier's law of the land, deep in the wild, wild west, beware of the man with only one detector...for he most assuredly knows how to use it!
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Re: Comparison test: Compass RM7A vs Whites GMT vs Minelab 3000

dangeorge
Curious........What are the oprating KHz of the three detectors used?..........Interesting the gap in the GMT test...............sanGeorge
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Re: Comparison test: Compass RM7A vs Whites GMT vs Minelab 3000

FoilFinder
dG, the GMT runs 50khz, the RM7 runs at 3.7khz, these are VLF machines.
The Minelab GPX and SD units are pulse they are a different animal, pulse technology handles the mineralization the best.
 The GPX detectors are optimized to finding smaller targets due to the fact that the short pulse frequency has been raised to 25 khz and long pulse to around 4.5 khz. The older models such as the SD and GP ran around 16 Khz and 1.5 khz on the long pulse and this is consistent with longer on times needed to energize large deep nuggets.

I may have been a little harsh on the GMT. It's really is a good machine. Too get the best out it in bad ground, one must crank up the hypersat but it has a repercussions in doing so, the depth achieved diminishes.
A little known fact of the GMT is you can run it on the dry beach sand for that micro jewelry.
Here is how to set it up:

Events, New Models, New Specials, Comments, TIPS. Questions About Your Metal Detector? Ask Greg @ au4greg@sbcglobal.net
March 6, 2009: Different Strategies for White's Goldmaster GMT
What to find jewelry other's have missed with their general purpose detectors whether its Surf or Turf.... read on

White's in general as well as some dealers have not recommended the High Frequency White's Goldmaster GMT for such applications deferring to the Multi-Frequency DFX, Surfmaster PI, TDI, or Beach Hunter because of their Selectivity and Ability to Ignore Wet Salts and Minerals. Higher frequencies above 15 kHz increase the reactiveness of Salt which will cause false signals if mis-tuned.

I've used the GMT at our Half Moon Bay Beaches to the Big Island of Hawaii. I'll share some of the Secret Tips and Strategies that have been shared by numerous discussions and field use by my associate Dealers and Distributors....read on Toadman

White's Electronics in their Advertisements does not promote the Goldmaster Series and latest model the Goldmaster GMT as an ideal detector for hunting Salt or Fresh Water Beaches or Trash Infested Ball Fields... deferring to their Prizm and E-Series general purpose detectors which operate at lower frequencies of 3 kHz to 15 kHz and Visual Discrimination that allow you to identify many of the coins in the ground as Nickel, Penny, Dime, Quater etc.
Trans Bay encourages your primary White's Detector to be a general purpose, but this doesn't mean that if you have a Goldmaster lying around waiting for the next trip up to the gold country it has to be in storage or hiding in the Closet... Come out of the Closet and put it to use... here's how take ADVANTAGE of the Goldmaster's ULRA Sensitive 48 to 50 kHz circuit and locate those elusive rings, jewelry that are missed by a general purpose detector.
Here's some of Trans Bay's Tuning Secrets....

By Land:

* Sensitivity on Preset
* Loud Shallow Sounding Targets: Then Reduce Sensitivity to Lowest Point and compare Signals (Small shards and Foil become virtually ignored while Rings, Coins, Tab size signals stay strong.
* SAT usually preset but increase to ensure a smooth self adjusting threshold that is non-reactive to ground.
* Iron ID Indicator is generally very accurate
* Tracking Off... usually not necessarily in homogenous turf conditions... using the Grab Button is more than sufficient to cancel out ground soil reactivity

By Sea: WET SALT Water Beaches:

* Reduce Sensitivity to the 'Down Low'
* Increase the SAT Speed
* Tracking On to Ground where black sand is (West Coast) 
* Tracking On to Salt where white sand (East Coast-Florida)
* Threshold is maintained; Smooth and Steady
* Over the wet sand will call for SAT to be increased to Hyper SAT
* Fringe Target Signals can be checked by applying the Audio Boost Toggle


The unique Iron Indicator will feed you additional information on the % of Iron in the metal to help you make a choice of whether to dig it, particularly under turf conditions where you don't have the Tides and Swells taking care of most of the nuisance tin foil. 

Conclusion: I don't normally tout the GMT as the end all detector at a Salt Water Beach or Park, School Grounds or Ball Fields but its an alternative detector that will find Micro Jewelry at deeper depths. But, if you own one in addition to any of the White's General Purpose Units... its fun to go back to your regularly hunted sites and see what you and others have missed by using this High Frequency Power House. The Tot Lots yield a higher % of lost jewelry and coins due to the activity of Children and Adult Guardians in a small defined area, and The Goldmaster GMT can cut through their White Sand or Tan Bark almost like an air test for exceptional depth without the taxing effects of a motion discriminator circuit.

Remember that All Metal will reach out deeper with most circuits and give you a clear look at that target in terms of its Size, Shape and Ramping Response. Since the Goldmaster is an All Metal Single Channel/Filter its performance on Coins, Rings, Gold Chains, Earrings will surprise you.

Although most dealers will not encourage you to buy the Goldmaster GMT for applications other than actually hunting for gold nuggets, when properly adjusted, it can be an effective Coin, Jewelry, Relic or even Cache Hunter.

Wet Salt Falsing or Noise can be Tamed by Proper Adjustments of the GMT Controls and Slowing down the Sweep Speed.

Campbell Soups now feature Low Sodium Sea Salt so try a can for lunch before you pull your GMT out of the closet and hit the Tot Lots.

Special Thanks to Jimmy Sierra (Whites of California) , Allan Cannon (Compass Electronics), Trapper Larry Manger (Big Valley Metal Detectors, Citris Heights, CA), Jim McCulloch (Southern Cal Dealer/Gold Show Circuit) and Steve 'The Alaskan' Herschbach for their contributions & shared Tips on the Whites Goldmaser GMT's Fine Tuning for Success. Can't forget Andy Sabisch, Author, Field Testor and just a Great All Around Detectorist, Long Time White's Detector user since his Innocent Teens, and hopefully a future White's Professional Dealer if Andy can 'settle down'.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

HH
FoilFinder
In the ol'frontier's law of the land, deep in the wild, wild west, beware of the man with only one detector...for he most assuredly knows how to use it!
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Re: Comparison test: Compass RM7A vs Whites GMT vs Minelab 3000

Canuck-luck
?..........Interesting the gap in the GMT test...............sanGeorge  

D_G, the gap of information missing regarding the 1/2 gram and the 4 gram nugget tests are because I never had those pieces of gold when I had a chance to use my friends GMT.

But it is interesting to note that at 10 inches or more the old Compass is at least on par with the 5 year old Whites GMT. Weird huh . . . I guess it was designed  to get into the .1 grain catagory with the GB.

Thanks Foil finder for that extra information, I'll pass it on to my friend with the GMT.

Another interesting thought is that gold is currently trading at $45/gram so my compass can only find gold from $9/Dig or more. :P

Ron
Compass Relic Magnum 7 A
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Re: Comparison test: Compass RM7A vs Whites GMT vs Minelab 3000

FoilFinder
Here is a related post:

Yah Joe your right, my XL500 pulse works well in the blacksand for sure. Just wanted to know if the Relic Magnums are an overlooked alternative to the Sovereigns and the CZs for VLF detectors on the beach.
Remember I bought the non working new RM7 in it's original box just before your surgery? Well I bought a second working one shortly after and changed out the faulty main board and installed it in the new RM7, it works great!
Remember the Relic Magnum kicked the Whites V Supreme in the wet black sand  silver shoot out:

 

Here is an interesting post of a beach silver test showdown between a Compass Relic Magnum  and the famous Whites V Supreme. These babies go deep in blacksand!

                                       FoilFinder
=================================================================
Re: Compass Magnum vs. Whites 5 GEB
June 24, 2000 at 10:59:50
In Reply to: Compass Magnum 320 V. Garrett GTI 2500
posted by Greg, Trans Bay Metal Detectors Foster City on June 16, 2000 at 21:26:20

Greg, Always impressed with your knowledge. back in 1979 or somewhere around there the Treasure Hunters Society of Sant Clara Valley put on a Thunt at Lake Comanche. The beach sand was terribly mineralized there. Anyway after the hunt we had a detector "showdown". We buried a silver quarter progressivly deeper and deeper until the only two detectors left were the Grover Ingram's Compass Relic Magnum and Bob White's 5 GEB. Well after about 9 inches the whites lost the target and the Relic Magnum was still reading it strong. The Whites guys couldn't believe it.

Jungle Jim

================================================================

FoilFinder
In the ol'frontier's law of the land, deep in the wild, wild west, beware of the man with only one detector...for he most assuredly knows how to use it!

Melbeta
[Selected post] Mar 22, 2010; 02:10pm
Re: Joe(Tx)The Relic Magnum 7 Runneth!
       
FoilFinder,
Are you speaking of the Whites Coinmaster 5 Supreme? If so, that is a really sensitive machine, it was set at 1.785 khz frequency, has ample penlight battery power, and was extremely sensitive. It was so sensitive that it made guys dig so much, especially in parks and around old houses. And it had those 10 turn knobs too, I hate their use, but they really fine tune something good. But it could really get rid of the most extreme ground mineralization...
FoilFinder
[Selected post] Mar 22, 2010; 04:03pm
Re: Joe(Tx)The Relic Magnum 7 Runneth!
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FoilFinder [User is online]
865 posts
       
This post was updated on Mar 22, 2010; 09:52pm.
Yup that's the puppy,at 1.8khz, it sure liked nails as did most low frequency detectors, but they almost see through blacksand as does the Relic Magnum  at 3.7khz. Blacksand pretty much blinds the 50-100khz detectors although they are touted to be really sensitive to gold.
While most manufacturers mostly abandoned their under 7khz machines in favour of gold sensitivity and iron rejection. I beleive the sub 6khz detectors still have a viable use for silver hunting, relic hunting, beach hunting in blacksand and prospecting in ultramafic conditions where any discrimination is a hinderance in depth and misinterperated targets. Reliable discrimination beyond 6" is difficult in mineralized soil anyway.
The Fisher 1280 used 2.4khz and was later compacted and surface mounted into the DetectorPro Pirate which also runs at 2.4khz, all the circuitry is contained in the headphones. Cool concept! No manual ground balance though.
The multi-frequency machine like the Sovereigns, Fisher CZs and the DFX cuts through the mineralization well and are the accepted VLF norms for this type of hunting, but I believe the single low frequency detects smaller targets deeper.

Foilfinder
In the ol'frontier's law of the land, deep in the wild, wild west, beware of the man with only one detector...for he most assuredly knows how to use it!
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Re: Comparison test: Compass RM7A vs Whites GMT vs Minelab 3000

FoilFinder
This is too funny! This guy got himself a top of the line Whites V3. have a look at this:

http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.php/topic,313684.0.html

Simplicity is efficiency, that's what I always say!
Seems the ol' Compass still runs with the big dogs folks!


HH

FoilFinder
In the ol'frontier's law of the land, deep in the wild, wild west, beware of the man with only one detector...for he most assuredly knows how to use it!
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Re: Comparison test: Compass RM7A vs Whites GMT vs Minelab 3000

Canuck-luck
Thanks for the article Foilfinder. I could almost see the disgust on that guys face as he swung his +$1000 new detector up against that tough old relic. But it sounds like he eventually worked the bugs out of his new gear.  LOL.


Ron
Compass Relic Magnum 7 A
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Re: Comparison test: Compass RM7A vs Whites GMT vs Minelab 3000

Melbeta
In reply to this post by FoilFinder
Quote:
Here is an interesting post of a beach silver test showdown between a Compass Relic Magnum  and the famous Whites V Supreme. These babies go deep in blacksand!

                                       FoilFinder
=================================================================
Re: Compass Magnum vs. Whites 5 GEB
June 24, 2000 at 10:59:50
In Reply to: Compass Magnum 320 V. Garrett GTI 2500
posted by Greg, Trans Bay Metal Detectors Foster City on June 16, 2000 at 21:26:20

Greg, Always impressed with your knowledge. back in 1979 or somewhere around there the Treasure Hunters Society of Sant Clara Valley put on a Thunt at Lake Comanche. The beach sand was terribly mineralized there. Anyway after the hunt we had a detector "showdown". We buried a silver quarter progressivly deeper and deeper until the only two detectors left were the Grover Ingram's Compass Relic Magnum and Bob White's 5 GEB. Well after about 9 inches the whites lost the target and the Relic Magnum was still reading it strong. The Whites guys couldn't believe it.

Jungle Jim
UnQuote:

Now I might have been a bit lost in this posting, but it seems it is comparing a Compass Magnum, not a Relic Magnum which is older and not as good a detector, against a Whites Coinmaster 5 GEB, which is NOT a Whites Coinmaster V Supreme detector. Be careful, and compare apples with apples, not apples with oranges. The Compass Magnum 320 machine is FAR SUPERIOR to the Relic Magnum 6 or 7 detector. In fact, the last model, was the Compass Magnum 240, and it makes the Compass Relic Magnum 7 Automatic look like a toy detector. I ran those two out in the soil, side by side, in actual target location. And the Whites Coinmaster 5 GEB is NOT as good a machine as the Whites Coinmaster V Supreme. The Supreme was TOO HOT and they scaled it back when they brought out the 4 GEB, 5 GEB, and 6 GEB. The V Supreme was so hot of a detector, it found even rust particles in the sand of Padre Island, so much that it was ruled not too good of a gold nugget machine as it found too much iron so that you would be digging too much.
Melbeta
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